New gravel saddles for Clydesdale riders?

22 replies · 1,891 views

Familyridz
70 posts
#1May 23, 2021, 7:54 AM
For you big guys out there, anyone over 240 lbs with 150mm ish sit bones have a saddle they like? My Ergon SM Pro M/L has been pretty good, but is starting to sag (only rated to 220 lbs). I prefer smooth covers over its grippy top. Their road version has a smooth cover, but a much smaller cut out that doesn't work for me. Any other saddle that worked for me in the past is discontinued, like the Selle Italia Turbomatic https://www.amazon.com/selle-ITALIA-Turbomatic-Flow-Saddle/dp/B07BZV7QVK, or this ancient Avocet O2 in 163 width. It was a Bicycling Mag editors' and readers' choice back in the day, apparently manufactured by Selle Italia, but haven't seen anything like it in 20 years. Their short rail design reduced sagging in the middle and it had air pockets like Nike Air shoes under your sit bones.

I'm particularly wondering about this one https://www.biketiresdirect.com/product/selle-italia-novus-boost-gravel-tech-superflow-saddle?sesgl=1&ssn=70832. Any big guys tried that one?

Thanks!
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Volsung
878 posts
#2May 23, 2021, 9:51 AM
Regardless of your weight you should be wary of Selle Italia. All of their weights are way off, and since the saddles curve down at the edges their width measurements are off.

If they fit you they fit you though.

I think Brooks Cambiums are 168 width. Selle Anatomica is similar and have different versions for different weight riders. I want to try their rubber top one someday.
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cjmeyers58
2 posts
#3May 24, 2021, 8:54 PM
In hopes of escaping perineal numbness, I tried a handful of different saddles. Some made it worse, some better. I also tried varying saddle tilt, height and clocking the nose of the saddle right or left of center alignment up to a few degrees either direction. Clocking actually made more difference than saddle choice, etc. However, numbness was still inescapable. Then I tried the Selle Anatomica saddle, leather, with the cutout. Voila! First saddle ever in 40 years of cycling that eliminated the numbness. I'm hooked. Of course, saddles are unique, the same saddle although the one for lighter riders did not work for my wife. Her go to, a Terry saddle.

Worth a try, BTW, is a women's specific saddle especially if you have wider sit bones. For me, that was the next best thing to the SA saddle.

Good luck! The search can be frustrating.

Cheers!
C
1
Toadmeister
53 posts
#4May 25, 2021, 6:58 AMedited
I'm a 6'4" 270# Clyde.

My Brooks Cadmium is the most comfortable saddle I've found out of the box, almost no break in time required. I got the kind with the cut-out.

I also have a traditional leather Brooks B-17 on my road bike but find the Cadmium better for Gravel. The leather Brooks also took FOREVER to break-in.
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Familyridz
70 posts
#5May 26, 2021, 8:58 AMedited
Volsung wrote:Regardless of your weight you should be wary of Selle Italia. All of their weights are way off, and since the saddles curve down at the edges their width measurements are off.

At combined weight for someone over 250 +gravel bike with discs and larger tires, bottles, etc. I have always figured even 100 more grams for being able to stay comfortable in an optimal pedaling position for 30+ minutes longer was a good deal. I don't weigh saddles beyond picking them up, and generally find I have to worry more about light ones not having enough high density padding. For the SI saddles I have had (all flatter profiles, except for the Turbomatic) I have not found the curving issue to be an issue like it is with Specialized Romin & Phenom lines. Unfortunately, SI (Fizik too) just have not made performance saddles wider than 145. What I did find on the newer Elite Max saddle was that the shell was too flexible, and if your sit bones were outside the rear rail attachment points, the wings went down and the center flexed up.

My LBS used to recommend this (now discontinued) Specialized saddle https://road.cc/content/review/228087-specialized-ruby-expert-saddle for big guys with wide sit bones. It has a firm shell that flexes less than many men's saddles under the weight of 250+ riders, and a thin but firm padding that takes longer to compress down/bottom out than most, and a nice narrow mid section. It's on my road bike, and less cushy than the Ergon MTB pro saddles, so not ideal for gravel.
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Familyridz
70 posts
#6May 26, 2021, 9:14 AMedited
Toadmeister wrote:I'm a 6'4" 270# Clyde.

My Brooks Cadmium is the most comfortable saddle I've found out of the box, almost no break in time required. I got the kind with the cut-out.

I also have a traditional leather Brooks B-17 on my road bike but find the Cadmium better for Gravel. The leather Brooks also took FOREVER to break-in.

Like you, I tried a Brooks Pro in my college days, put several thousand miles on it, diligently cleaning and proof hiding it--and it looked and felt like new when my sit bone area simply could not take it anymore and I gave up. Riding hard in mid-Atlantic summer heat and humidity, I sweat like crazy, so I don't know if the sweat washed out the proof hide and made it hard or what, but that was a miserable summer.

Do you find the Cadmium cover is slick or grippy? Chafing has always been an issue for me as my thighs rub even the narrowest saddle midsection.

Does the Cadmium stretch out? I tried the Selle Anatomica Titanico X https://bikepacking.com/gear/selle-anatomica-titanico-the-best-bike-touring-saddle/ and kept turning the extender nut as it it kept stretching out, but even with it installed as nose up as I could stand it (just on the hoods, forget the drops) I kept sliding to the narrower mid section as the saddle sagged. I finally hit the end of the threads, and was told by SA I had essentially wrecked the saddle by overtightening it, but never could stop from sliding to the narrower middle at any useable saddle angle.

I ran into one guy on the trail who loved his, but from how it had worn in, he was clearly sitting almost in the middle. On the Cadmium, are you able to keep it just a few degrees nose up and keep from sliding to the middle?

Thanks!
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imwjl
304 posts
#7May 27, 2021, 5:58 AM
WTB Pure series seem popular regardless of one's weight or gender. I can vouch for big and heavy friends liking them as much as my wife and I do.

Some of my heavy friends swear by B-17s but warn as I will to be aware of the break-in whether that's the saddle or your butt.
One taller and heavier friend swears by the Selle Anatomicas that accommodate weight difference.
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Volsung
878 posts
#8May 27, 2021, 6:43 AM
I tip all my Cambiums up a bit to stop from sliding forward, but the tip angle depends on handlebar height. The more of a drop I have, the more level my saddles are.

The newer all weather Cambiums are more slippery than the originals and maybe a bit stiffer, which could benefit you with your weight.

They don't really stretch since their rubber but they do break in a bit.
1
Toadmeister
53 posts
#9May 27, 2021, 10:28 AM
Familyridz wrote:
Like you, I tried a Brooks Pro in my college days, put several thousand miles on it, diligently cleaning and proof hiding it--and it looked and felt like new when my sit bone area simply could not take it anymore and I gave up. Riding hard in mid-Atlantic summer heat and humidity, I sweat like crazy, so I don't know if the sweat washed out the proof hide and made it hard or what, but that was a miserable summer.

Do you find the Cadmium cover is slick or grippy? Chafing has always been an issue for me as my thighs rub even the narrowest saddle midsection.

Does the Cadmium stretch out? I tried the Selle Anatomica Titanico X https://bikepacking.com/gear/selle-anatomica-titanico-the-best-bike-touring-saddle/ and kept turning the extender nut as it it kept stretching out, but even with it installed as nose up as I could stand it (just on the hoods, forget the drops) I kept sliding to the narrower mid section as the saddle sagged. I finally hit the end of the threads, and was told by SA I had essentially wrecked the saddle by overtightening it, but never could stop from sliding to the narrower middle at any useable saddle angle.

I ran into one guy on the trail who loved his, but from how it had worn in, he was clearly sitting almost in the middle. On the Cadmium, are you able to keep it just a few degrees nose up and keep from sliding to the middle?

My Cadmium is roughly level. Initially I thought the Cadmium was a little grippy but it has smoothed out I think. No chafing issues with Chamios and butter and it actually feels pretty good running naked (regular underoos and shorts) for short rides.

My Leather B17 Brooks after ~6000 miles is getting pretty wore out. I keep adding tension but it's loosing it's "oomph". I'll probably replace with a Brooks Cadmium.

Thanks!
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Familyridz
70 posts
#10May 28, 2021, 12:01 AMedited
imwjl wrote:
WTB Pure series seem popular regardless of one's weight or gender. I can vouch for big and heavy friends liking them as much as my wife and I do.

About 20 years ago I rented a hardtail to explore the Kananaskis Nordic Centre trails https://www.albertaparks.ca/parks/kananaskis/canmore-nordic-centre-pp/park-facilities/visitor-guide/ --and thanks for jogging my memory, because the longer, straighter trails there will make for an awesome gravel trip once the kids are older! That bike had a WTB saddle that was one of the best saddles I ever rode. I think it must have been a special version for that bike brand, as I've never found it. Unfortunately, what comes after "Pure" is either "Rocket" not available in wide sizes, or "V" which means wide midsection and chafing for me. Hadn't searched the WTB line up in a while, and your post led me to--surprise--Guitar Ted https://www.ridinggravel.com/components/wtb-silverado-and-sl8-saddles-quick-review/

The Wide SL8 could be a winner, as the staff shell description would fix the issue I have with my Volt. WTB is sold out of everything, and I could only find the entry level one with the softer deeper padding online.

I have a Volt on my MTB, as it gets ridden least these days, and it shares an issue I ran into when SI introduced a wider, flatter Flite saddle with a similar shape several years ago (not the current Flite Boost, which might also be good). On both, the shell cut out compromised lateral stiffness. My sit bones were outside of the lines between front and rear rail attachment points on the Flite, so the wings flopped down, and center flopped up, putting pressure in exactly the worst place--a very short test ride. The wide Volt is wider and took about a month to flex into an uncomfortable shape (the shell has a cut out even though the cover doesn't), and in this case the middle sinks and the outside edges rise, so I get pressure at the saddle edge--better there than in the middle, but still painful far too soon.

I found the Selle Italia Gravel Tech on Amazon with free returns, so I'll tape up the rails and give it a ride or two and let you guys know how it feels.
imwjl
304 posts
#11May 28, 2021, 8:17 AMedited
Familyridz wrote:

About 20 years ago I rented a hardtail to explore the Kananaskis Nordic Centre trails https://www.albertaparks.ca/parks/kananaskis/canmore-nordic-centre-pp/park-facilities/visitor-guide/ --and thanks for jogging my memory, because the longer, straighter trails there will make for an awesome gravel trip once the kids are older! That bike had a WTB saddle that was one of the best saddles I ever rode. I think it must have been a special version for that bike brand, as I've never found it. Unfortunately, what comes after "Pure" is either "Rocket" not available in wide sizes, or "V" which means wide midsection and chafing for me. Hadn't searched the WTB line up in a while, and your post led me to--surprise--Guitar Ted https://www.ridinggravel.com/components/wtb-silverado-and-sl8-saddles-quick-review/

The Wide SL8 could be a winner, as the staff shell description would fix the issue I have with my Volt. WTB is sold out of everything, and I could only find the entry level one with the softer deeper padding online.

I have a Volt on my MTB, as it gets ridden least these days, and it shares an issue I ran into when SI introduced a wider, flatter Flite saddle with a similar shape several years ago (not the current Flite Boost, which might also be good). On both, the shell cut out compromised lateral stiffness. My sit bones were outside of the lines between front and rear rail attachment points on the Flite, so the wings flopped down, and center flopped up, putting pressure in exactly the worst place--a very short test ride. The wide Volt is wider and took about a month to flex into an uncomfortable shape (the shell has a cut out even though the cover doesn't), and in this case the middle sinks and the outside edges rise, so I get pressure at the saddle edge--better there than in the middle, but still painful far too soon.

I found the Selle Italia Gravel Tech on Amazon with free returns, so I'll tape up the rails and give it a ride or two and let you guys know how it feels.

Pure models are on the wide side of medium - 148 mm. A bike shop associate purposely tries to stock the basic and a higher end model knowing they satisfy so many people. He says they're very popular with men and women. It seems telling that it's the one saddle of many that lets my wife and I be happy on same bike.

I have Volt and SL8 model that came on Kona bikes. You're off target if you think they are alike or like a Pure.
jfranci3
126 posts
#12May 28, 2021, 8:45 AM
Aside from the saddle, you can play with the fit of the bike.
1) lowering the bars will take weight off your bottom.
2) pedaling hard (lower cadence) will take weight off your bottom.
3) moving the saddle backward might take weight off your bottom.
4) lowering your saddle will make your hips move less and put less strain on your bottom.
5) Changing the tilt of the saddle will change the distribution of the weight on your bottom.

Having said that, I've tried a bunch of saddles and the Brooks Cambium Carved (with the hole in it) is uniquely good at at reducing bottom strain (a full level better than the standard Cambium) because it can stretch, move, and doesn't have a bottom plate. It's not especially good for sitting up cruising, you want something wide and lots of padding for that. For something athletic, you want with just the right shape that's more of a narrow prop. Thigh gap will tell you how wide the nose can be, sit bones will tell you how wide the back should be.
If you're trying saddles, try them without bike shorts on and at your cruising pace. They'll all feel fine when you get on it. Order a bunch, wrap the rails in tape or something, mount them, try them, return the misses. Measure the distance to the bars from the BACK of the saddle, which is where the back of your pelvis is going to land.
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Familyridz
70 posts
#13May 28, 2021, 10:40 AM
Thanks. My position is pretty dialed in after probably 40,000 plus road miles over the years—mostly long ago. I notice a mm of seat post slip petty quick. I am a chameleon in Fizik’s concept http://slocyclist.com/whats-up-with-bulls-snakes-and-chameleons-fiziks-curve-saddles-at-the-2013-tour-de-france/

And as your pelvis rolls forward for chameleons or bulls, your sit bones are angled and narrow. In Selle Italia terms, as best I can tell, Bull need s1 to L1 with smaller cut outs, and snakes need S3 to L3 for large cut outs.

There is also just an issue of upper body weight, the saddle contact patch of a 220 pound rider with lighter bones and smaller upper body is about the same size as that of a 250+ rider with higher bone density and a bigger torso who puts more PSI on the seat. Some day I’ll try to patent a couple of ideas I have for making saddles more tuneable, but for almost anyone who ever played lineman, linebacker, full back etc even on a decent high school team, most bike saddles are designed with padding that fully compresses or shells that flex/stretch too much once you go much over 200lbs. Then they wonder why big guys don’t bike. Anyone in bike design looked at the average weight of American males lately?

My 2011 Madone is rated at 300 lbs of rider weight but current Checkpoints and many other brands’ gravel bikes supposedly capable of carrying tons of water for bike packing are rated at 275 or less!
1
Familyridz
70 posts
#14Jun 10, 2021, 12:57 PM
I know the difference, it’s just the Pure
Line is only offered medium width according to WTB:

https://www.wtb.com/collections/wide-saddles

It used to be called “Pure V” and it really is V shaped. I need a T shape. Because of the V, it’s widest point is very close to the rear, and if you have big legs, you have to sit well in front of the widest point to not get chafed on the wide midsection, so for me, it rides like a 140, and I still get chafed.

Your note did prompt me to notice that the Rocket is now offered at 150mm, which I am pretty sure it wasn’t last time I bought a saddle, and it looks flatter. With the WTB design overhaul, https://youtu.be/i_xQg6IP-Wk

It sounds like every WTB saddle has similar shell material, but not shape and cut outs, and same padding material, but not thickness, at the same rail trim line.

I found Colorado Cyclist has the Ergon SM Pro I wore out in stock, which no else I’ve bought from including Ergon does, so I’ve ordered that one, but I’ll give the wide Rocket a try later for the MTB.

The Selle Graveltech has already been returned. Grippiest saddle cover I have ever seen—shorts were almost Velcroed to it. I could tell it really is designed for the L3/Fizik Snake body types who either ride really upright or keep their pelvis planted and flex at the spine to bend forward. As I rolled forward even to the hoods, the padding felt much worse, and by the end of the 2nd ride, I was sinking in too deep. It’s hard for me to think there is someone who wouldn’t be more comfortable on one of their other saddles, like one of the Max Flite or Max SLR Saddles.

Thanks for the WTB nudge—I didn’t look at the new line hard because WTB was out of stock.
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EBG18T
53 posts
#15Jun 12, 2021, 5:53 PMedited
I would suggest also checking out SQLabs. I used to sell a ton of Ergon saddles during bike fits. I’ve since switched to only offering SQLabs saddles. Great quality and lots of width/length options. You can request a free fit kit (cardboard for sit bone impression and cross reference sheet to explain the saddles) from the site and then reference the site for options.
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Pipeliner
129 posts
#16Jun 18, 2021, 3:33 PM
I’m 240 have been on the Selle Anatomical something-or-other (whatever they recommend for lardasses like me). It it the best I’ve tried by far. Actually have 2 of em, one on a road bike, one for my gravel rig.Have not tried the Brooks Cambium but ordered one I’ll be trying soon.
1
JWB475
154 posts
#17Jun 20, 2021, 10:06 AM
I switched to SQ Labs saddles this year on my Gravel and Mountain bike and really like them. Eliminated some numbness issues I had with the Selle Italia saddles I was using (I'm a 200 pounder)...

EBG18T wrote:I would suggest also checking out SQLabs. I used to sell a ton of Ergon saddles during bike fits. I’ve since switched to only offering SQLabs saddles. Great quality and lots of width/length options. You can request a free fit kit (cardboard for sit bone impression and cross reference sheet to explain the saddles) from the site and then reference the site for options.
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Familyridz
70 posts
#18Jun 20, 2021, 11:41 AM
From looking at the SQLabs site, all of their saddles are V-shaped. For those of us who need something more T shaped like the Ergon or WTB Volt, I don't see it. Is there a more T -shaped model?
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EBG18T
53 posts
#19Jun 20, 2021, 12:29 PM
Familyridz wrote:From looking at the SQLabs site, all of their saddles are V-shaped. For those of us who need something more T shaped like the Ergon or WTB Volt, I don't see it. Is there a more T -shaped model?

As far as I know from talking to the rep, all of the SQLabs are going to be based on a v-shaped concept. But the step design in the rear seem to work for some people that prefer support and tend to keep their weight for rearward versus the other side where folks that tend to roll their pelvis forward. It seems many manufacturers approach the T vs V shape with different ideas on blurring the lines which is frustrating. But to answer your question, no true T design. Just the blurred v-design approach.
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Familyridz
70 posts
#20Jun 20, 2021, 12:56 PM
Thanks. Lots of bigger riders have thighs that rub even narrower saddles. The Specialized power series digs into mine and has a similar top profile.

Selle Italia has abandoned it’s 2 series—S2,L2—performance saddles for the Fizik chameleon types. I would think in addition to people like me whose spines flex some, if you need their L1-S1/Fizik Bull in a drop bar road position, then on higher stack gravel hoods, you probably need a 2.

Do you know of anything for 150mm sit bones in a flat T shape aside from Ergon and WTB Rocket? Selle Anatomica Titannico X just had me sliding to the narrower middle until I over tightened it, which was worse. I assume the same thing would happen on most saddles that rely on stretched leather rather than a padded shell.
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