I am pretty sure I saw this bike at a gravel bike race yesterday and know nothing about it. I did pick it up and it was light as a feather. I have thoughts of buying myself a really expensive gravel bike 2-3 years from now when I retire. Before I saw this bike these were the 2 bikes on the radar.
Aside from the price, my main concern is the racy geometry. The head tubes are relatively short for a gravel bike so you need a lot of spacers unless you really like a racy position on the bike and the head tube angle is pretty steep. The bike in your pic has a good amount of spacers and still has a lot of saddle to bar drop. The Lynskey and Salsa both have geometry better suited to those of us who arent professional racers. I can’t deny they are light and nice looking, but there is more to a bike than that.
the UP and exploro, both designed by vroomen are definitely geared more toward hauling ass on dirt and tarmac alike. not so much long haul gravel riding (although i know a few people who use these bikes for long trips, they are in tip top cycling shape to begin with)
the UP geometry is the more 'gravel friendly' of the two, however when compared to other 'gravel specific' models, it's still quite aggressive.
that said, i love aggressive geometry on and off road and love the UP!
Thanks for those 2 replies and yes I didn't notice the large amount of saddle to handlebar drop. I didn't know that this bike has aggressive racing geometry so that would be out for me. What other bikes other than say the Jamis Renegade carbon and other carbon bikes could I throw in the mix to do some research on between now and then. The next bike would have to be 2x also not 1x.
I ride a Kona Rove ST full steel bike and while I really enjoy riding it and have built it up for long term dependability, at about 26 pounds, I do think I would appreciate dropping 8ish or more pounds when the races come around next year. The Open UP is definitely tempting in this regard and has some cool features like the dropped stay and the slacker seat tube to run a straight post. I also like the Ibis Hakka MX as well as the Donnelly G//C, thr Hakka has T47 BB which is cool and the Donnelly is a frame from a tire company but with some solid design experience behiind it.
I think the Kona Libre looks great for all around use, definitely a higher, more comfortable front end as well as ample clearance and mounts. However for me for this next racing style bike I think I would go closer to something like the Open.
In the mean time I will ride my stalwart steel rig any and everywhere!
ljsmith wrote:Aside from the price, my main concern is the racy geometry. The head tubes are relatively short for a gravel bike so you need a lot of spacers unless you really like a racy position on the bike and the head tube angle is pretty steep.
Same here. I don't have a problem with running a bunch of spacers, but can you do that on a carbon steerer?
My dream bike would be a Cutthroat, especially if I was older. Blinged out with a not yet existing drop bar Eagle group or a mountain 2x, a few wheelsets and possibly a suspension fork. Nice relaxed geometry do everything bike.
"Finally, the spacer height that can be safely used depends on the type of riding the bike will be subjected to. If the rider pedals it gently on smooth roads, the answer will be different than if he rides it into curbs and big potholes or off of semi-truck loading docks."
I know the second part is a bit over the top on purpose, but still the article looks at things from a road bike perspective. Generally i'm not afraid of carbon stuff at all, but sometimes I use my gravel bike on terrain where i'd be better off on an MTB. I think i'd have a hard time trusting a carbon steerer with a bunch of spacers when bombing down an offroad descend. Or is that paranoid?
"Finally, the spacer height that can be safely used depends on the type of riding the bike will be subjected to. If the rider pedals it gently on smooth roads, the answer will be different than if he rides it into curbs and big potholes or off of semi-truck loading docks."
I know the second part is a bit over the top on purpose, but still the article looks at things from a road bike perspective. Generally i'm not afraid of carbon stuff at all, but sometimes I use my gravel bike on terrain where i'd be better off on an MTB. I think i'd have a hard time trusting a carbon steerer with a bunch of spacers when bombing down an offroad descend. Or is that paranoid?
Most sources I have read say 30-40mm of spacers is the max for a carbon steerer. Not only is it dangerous to have too many, but it also shows you chose the wrong frame-its either too small or not the right geometry for your intended use. I agree with you, I often ride singletrack on my gravel bike, and without a suspension fork the fork takes a lot more abuse than my mountain bike probably. But a giant stack of spacers also looks horrible.
Zurichman wrote:Thanks for those 2 replies and yes I didn't notice the large amount of saddle to handlebar drop. I didn't know that this bike has aggressive racing geometry so that would be out for me. What other bikes other than say the Jamis Renegade carbon and other carbon bikes could I throw in the mix to do some research on between now and then. The next bike would have to be 2x also not 1x.
Thanks Zman
You have a carbon Roker now right? If you like it, why not just build it up with light components and wheels. The Open UP frame is probably only around 200g lighter than your Roker.
Most sources I have read say 30-40mm of spacers is the max for a carbon steerer. Not only is it dangerous to have too many, but it also shows you chose the wrong frame-its either too small or not the right geometry for your intended use. I agree with you, I often ride singletrack on my gravel bike, and without a suspension fork the fork takes a lot more abuse than my mountain bike probably. But a giant stack of spacers also looks horrible.
I currently have 40mm (and a +6 degree stem) on my gravel bike that has a steel steerer. I like an upright position and my neck is not the best. Although I think 40 mil is not that much.
I see a lot of frames that would be perfect, they tick every box, it's only the damn stack height that's too low.
You have a carbon Roker now right? If you like it, why not just build it up with light components and wheels. The Open UP frame is probably only around 200g lighter than your Roker.
Thanks for that reply ljsmith. Yes you are right and probably will go that route. My main problem is I don't know enough about bicycle components to know lets say what is a lighter version crank of say the Shimano 2x 105. I am going that route for sure after this weekend. I rode with a 63 year old on flat rails and trails and couldn't find the right gearing in the bottom 4-5 gears as there is just too much jumps in gears for me. Not sure if I will get that done this winter or not.
I have some potential info on the headtube length for the Open: in 2019, it is going UP!
I stopped by my Open dealer today and see if they had a Large for me to demo. Unfortunately they only had a Small and Medium, and might not be getting any more demos until after January, because they have been told there are some changes coming to the bike that they are waiting on. They don't know exactly what ALL of them are, but one change or option they have been told about is a taller head tube.
That said, they did have a Large frameset for sale that did not work for another customer, and the price is very, very good...
Thanks for that reply ljsmith. Yes you are right and probably will go that route. My main problem is I don't know enough about bicycle components to know lets say what is a lighter version crank of say the Shimano 2x 105. I am going that route for sure after this weekend. I rode with a 63 year old on flat rails and trails and couldn't find the right gearing in the bottom 4-5 gears as there is just too much jumps in gears for me. Not sure if I will get that done this winter or not.
Zman
With Shimano the levels from low to high are Tiagra, 105, Ultegra and Dura Ace. At each level the components get lighter. Ultegra and Dura Ace are of equal quality, but Dura Ace is lighter if you have deep pockets. But the most important change you can make is wheels. Light wheels dramatically change the feel of a bike because they accelerate and climb noticeably better. Most stock bikes come with wheels around 2000g. If you get a sub 1600g wheelset, you will feel a huge difference. After components and wheels then you can look at cockpit. Carbon seatpost can drop around 100g, titanium railed saddle another 50-100g. Its not hard to make a bike lighter, the real trick is doing it without breaking the bank. What are your gears right now? If you are 1x, a 2x setup should solve your problem.
With Shimano the levels from low to high are Tiagra, 105, Ultegra and Dura Ace. At each level the components get lighter. Ultegra and Dura Ace are of equal quality, but Dura Ace is lighter if you have deep pockets. But the most important change you can make is wheels. Light wheels dramatically change the feel of a bike because they accelerate and climb noticeably better. Most stock bikes come with wheels around 2000g. If you get a sub 1600g wheelset, you will feel a huge difference. After components and wheels then you can look at cockpit. Carbon seatpost can drop around 100g, titanium railed saddle another 50-100g. Its not hard to make a bike lighter, the real trick is doing it without breaking the bank. What are your gears right now? If you are 1x, a 2x setup should solve your problem.
ljsmith I understand the levels of Shimano coming from the roadie end. I have kind of deep pockets but not super deep pockets. So with that being said I will probably never run Dura Ace or the D12 electronics but you can never say never. I did see I think NoCooGreg post once about a weight weenies site. I for sure am going to go 2x but I don't know an after market mid price lighter crank lets say than either the 105 or Ultegra since I don't know anything other than Shimano or much about bike components. I might post a thread to get some suggestions for a lighter 2x crank than the Ultegra.
Zurichman wrote:I for sure am going to go 2x but I don't know an after market mid price lighter crank lets say than either the 105 or Ultegra since I don't know anything other than Shimano or much about bike components. I might post a thread to get some suggestions for a lighter 2x crank than the Ultegra.
That's not a problem, just check a webshop that has a good selection and the weights listed. If you open a thread a few people will do the same.
The Ultegra R8000 crankset is decently light tho, some carbon cranksets are barely lighter or weigh as much.
For example the weight difference between the Dura Ace R9100 and the Ultegra R8000 crankset is 60g (34-50 170mm), while the Dura Ace costs more than double.
Even though it looks like a big chunk of aluminium in this case i'm not sure if the crankset would be the smartest place to lose some weight. I've seen some carbon options that are not that more expensive but they're only around 50g lighter.
That's not a problem, just check a webshop that has a good selection and the weights listed. If you open a thread a few people will do the same.
The Ultegra R8000 crankset is decently light tho, some carbon cranksets are barely lighter or weigh as much.
For example the weight difference between the Dura Ace R9100 and the Ultegra R8000 crankset is 60g (34-50 170mm), while the Dura Ace costs more than double.
Even though it looks like a big chunk of aluminium in this case i'm not sure if the crankset would be the smartest place to lose some weight. I've seen some carbon options that are not that more expensive but they're only around 50g lighter.
Thanks for that reply HollyBoni I have to replace the crank anyways since I would be switching out the Sram 1x Rival to Shimano 2x and thought any weight savings I could get on the crank would help. Any webshops that you could recommend so I could start doing some research. I did see over at GravelCyclist that JOM there took a Raleigh Sport which starting weight was 2 1/2 lbs heavier than my Roker( 22 1/2 versus 20)and got it down to 17 1/2 lbs so maybe that would be worth looking at some of the things he did.
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If you open a thread a few people will do the same.