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Zurichman wrote:I guess I have a few different thought processes going thru my mine.\n \nThe math is easy; what is the lowest gear you’d run on a double? 50/34 chainrings with an 11-32 cassette only gets you down to a 34/32 bailout, which is still above 1:1. Even if you ran a 50T ring with the 11-50 cassette, you’d have a 50/50 climbing gear, which is direct drive (1:1). With my 44T ring, my bail-out (44/50) is full blown underdrive! The bigger question is: do you prefer to pedal descents to ludicrous speeds, or do you coast like I do once grades pitch under -5% and speeds exceed 30mph? \n \nEven if your LBS recommends against the 11-50, an 11-46 worked for me without even using a RoadLink and you’re still talking underdrive with a 44T ring, and the 44/11 is still tall enough for me to sprint to 30+ mph on flats. \n \n-Ed
1. I kind of plan on doing all the ultra gravel ride/races out there. DK200 will probably be last on the list but the Epic 150, Rebecca's private ride and a few others top this list. So that being said heck yes I could probably lose 10-15 lbs to get in better shape but at the end of the day a 5 lb+ lighter bike than my current Tamland 1 is going to make a big difference.
I am just curious about a carbon or a ti gravel bike so the Roker ticks off the carbon box.
My LBS doesn't like the 1x and I probably won't know if I like the 1x until I try it. I don't think I will be too much concerned about the gear jumps. I think it will all come down to does it climb as easy in the lowest 1x gearing like a 2x does.
Thanks for your input.
Zman
EddNog wrote: The math is easy; what is the lowest gear you’d run on a double? 50/34 chainrings with an 11-32 cassette only gets you down to a 34/32 bailout, which is still above 1:1. Even if you ran a 50T ring with the 11-50 cassette, you’d have a 50/50 climbing gear, which is direct drive (1:1). With my 44T ring, my bail-out (44/50) is full blown underdrive! The bigger question is: do you prefer to pedal descents to ludicrous speeds, or do you coast like I do once grades pitch under -5% and speeds exceed 30mph? Even if your LBS recommends against the 11-50, an 11-46 worked for me without even using a RoadLink and you’re still talking underdrive with a 44T ring, and the 44/11 is still tall enough for me to sprint to 30+ mph on flats. -Ed
Zurichman wrote:\n \nOof; that’s tough. The only suggestion I have is something extreme. If you had a SRAM groupset, I would suggest swapping to a GX 2x10 long cage derailleur and running an 11-42 cassette (I had a 50/36x11-42 setup on my previous road bike), but that is...overkill for most. \n \n-Ed
First thing I did when I tried my Tamland on my local mt was switch my Shimano 11-32 cassette to a 11-36 Sram with the road link. I still had a tough time at the Maple Century ride in Honesdale in the fall. Yes for sure I wasn't in the shape I should have been for that ride. I walked more hills/mts. that day than all my years of riding my road bike since 1992.
Zman
![[biggrin]](https://cdn.websitetoolbox.com/images/boards/smilies/biggrin.gif)
Regarding 1x vs 2x I'd say get that figured out before spending a bunch of money a new bike. Converting the Roker Comp to 2x could easily set you back $500 in parts alone and will be a minor PITA if you do the work yourself. If you're leaning toward 2x just find a bike you like that's already set up that way. I have the Roker Comp and really like the Rival 1x drivetrain, but would have been equally happy if the bike had come with a Shimano 2x groupset. I have thousands of miles on Ultegra 6800 and can find no fault with it--front shifting in particular is excellent. All that said, if I wanted to convert my Roker to 2x I wouldn't touch the 1x front brake lever. Just install a bar end shifter to handle front shifting. Cheap and easy.
squak wrote:Regarding 1x vs 2x I'd say get that figured out before spending a bunch of money a new bike. Converting the Roker Comp to 2x could easily set you back $500 in parts alone and will be a minor PITA if you do the work yourself. If you're leaning toward 2x just find a bike you like that's already set up that way. I have the Roker Comp and really like the Rival 1x drivetrain, but would have been equally happy if the bike had come with a Shimano 2x groupset. I have thousands of miles on Ultegra 6800 and can find no fault with it--front shifting in particular is excellent. All that said, if I wanted to convert my Roker to 2x I wouldn't touch the 1x front brake lever. Just install a bar end shifter to handle front shifting. Cheap and easy.
Zurichman wrote:
Hey squak thanks for this info. I am not the bike geek parts guy but I guess my LBS could figure out how to put the bar end shifter on the bike if I didn't like the 1x. Yes I have the 2016 Tamland 1 and luv it to death except for the what seems like 5 lbs. too heavy when I am climbing heavy stuff. Being the newbie to gravel riding and deciding to get into it around Easter after a drunk hit me in Jan. I don't have much to compare the Tamland 1 to as my only gravel/mt. bike before it was a cheapo Schwinn bike which was hardly a step up from a Wally World bike. So yeah the Tamland feels like a sweet ride to me after riding that. I can't justify going out and spending $3000 - $4000 for a gravel bike right now so yeah the Corporate discount rate for $1799 seems very tempting to me for sure. The other kicker even though I don't know if the 1x is going to fit my lifestyle/riding or not at least I know that I should like the frame/geometry as I already like the Tamland a very similar bike. I guess that is all for now. Do you see any negatives with the Roker Comp bike?
Thanks
Zman
squak wrote:
The Roker is great, but if you love your Tamland ride it into the ground. The only thing that kept me from getting the 2017 Tamland 2 instead of the Roker Comp was the mechanical disc brakes. Have you considered replacing your stock wheels? You could probably drop 1-2 lbs. of rotating weight without spending a fortune.
X1 vs. 2X:
I am personally a big fan of SRAM's X1 system. I'm running two gravel bikes (Specialized Sequoia and 2018 Diverge Expert) in the SRAM Force X1 set up. Both bikes are 44T up front with an 11x42 or 10x42 Cassette. I've done several hilly gravel events on both bikes including the DK200 this past summer (some horrific & long climbs). I've been an X1 convert since I ran it on my fatbike. Yes - there are "gaps." I don't find it to be an issue and if anything it's helped me to learn how to pedal within a slightly longer range of cadences. Additionally, if you're riding on a nasty "B" road or some really nasty, big rock type gravel, dropping a chain while shifting is a non-issue.
For you this is a personal decision (IMHO), but my LBS is a big proponent of SRAM overall and X1. Plenty of the shop guys run it on all of their bikes. I'm in the Chicago 'burbs too and know a few of the local SRAM guys. They are ALL running X1. If they get really anal about it, they just swap out chainrings and/or cassettes depending on the event type, terrain, etc.
bwepps wrote:\n \nYup, same here; absolutely love 1X and so converted all of my bikes to 1X. I do run even wider range; 1x11 11-50 with a 44T on my road bike, 1x10 11-46 with a 38T on my gravel bike (extra-short gearing for single track riding) and 1x10 11-42 with a 30T on my plus hardtail. I run solely SunRace cassettes, absoluteBLACK oval chainrings and KMC X1xSL-DLC chains. The road and gravel bikes are SRAM while the MTB is Shimano (OneUp’d derailleur with an XTR shifter that lets me upshift multiple cogs in one sweep, which is nice). \n \n-EdX1 vs. 2X:
I am personally a big fan of SRAM's X1 system. I'm running two gravel bikes (Specialized Sequoia and 2018 Diverge Expert) in the SRAM Force X1 set up. Both bikes are 44T up front with an 11x42 or 10x42 Cassette. I've done several hilly gravel events on both bikes including the DK200 this past summer (some horrific & long climbs). I've been an X1 convert since I ran it on my fatbike. Yes - there are "gaps." I don't find it to be an issue and if anything it's helped me to learn how to pedal within a slightly longer range of cadences. Additionally, if you're riding on a nasty "B" road or some really nasty, big rock type gravel, dropping a chain while shifting is a non-issue.
For you this is a personal decision (IMHO), but my LBS is a big proponent of SRAM overall and X1. Plenty of the shop guys run it on all of their bikes. I'm in the Chicago 'burbs too and know a few of the local SRAM guys. They are ALL running X1. If they get really anal about it, they just swap out chainrings and/or cassettes depending on the event type, terrain, etc.
dangle wrote:Zman,
Let's cut right to it: You're not going to do this. Ever. You are extremely cost conscious of every decision and we know you're not going to pay retail for these parts and pay to have them installed. It will never happen. Your LBS is not going to give you 'credit' for the 1x parts, especially on a bike you purchased online. A 1x specific front brake is worthless to them.
You don't need to change the crank. SRAMs 1x and 2x cranks are the same thing, just different paint. The offset their 1x rings so they can use the same cranks. You would need to buy two chainrings and longer chainring bolts, that's it.
I have no idea if there's cable routing for a front derailleur on that specific frame.
SRAM officially says that rear derailleur is not compatible in a 2x configuration. They work against the chain moving laterally up front. Anything "X-Horizon" isn't supposed to work with front shifting. I haven't tried it to know if there's a way around it. Basically, you can add a 10 speed, long cage mountain bike derailleur to the list if you want to go 2x. 10 speed mountain and 11 speed road/cyclocross have the same cable pull. That's what a lot of people do to get wide range and strong chain retention with SRAM road shifters.
If you ever pull the trigger on this bike, why not just try a smaller chainring up front? If you survived your other rides (lots of people walk nasty stuff) when "not in shape" with something like a 36:36 low gear, dropping down to a 36 or 38 single ring up front and 42 in the back (stock cassette) will be easier. It seems that most of the people complaining about 'gaps' in 1x drivetrains are the ones NOT riding 1x drivetrains. Yuck, I didn't intend to continue yet another 1x vs 2x drivetrain.
Zurichman wrote:I did get a reply back this morning from a local hardcore mt. bike/gravel bike racer and I think he mentioned the 10 speed set up you were talking about along with some other gearing options.
dangle wrote:
To be clear, it would still be 11 speeds in the back.
I'm sticking to my guns here. There's no way you would spend the money to convert that Roker Comp to 2x. Two chainrings, chainring bolts, front derailleur, rear derailleur, cable/housing, front shifter/brake combo, chain, cassette.....you might as well just buy another bike. Yes, it would be just as good or better than a factory setup. It would probably be $600-700 from an LBS before any installation costs. Two hours of labor costs? I'm just guessing at that.
It doesn't make fiscal sense from anybody looking at it just. If we go back to the 1x vs. 2x argument, it's only going to be about 13 distinctly different gears if you did keep that 11-42 cassette and do something like a 46/36 or 46/34 crankset. For as much as you have discussed weight and money, there's just no way. Run the options with the gearing calculator at https://www.sheldonbrown.com/gear-calc.html and you will see that going 2x on a wide range cassette doesn't open up a lot more gearing. There's a TON of redundancy.
The wheel upgrade still makes sense. There's builders here that can make a great wheelset and suggest a great tire for your riding for not too much money.
dangle wrote:I still think you should grab that Roker if you can get it around the price you have mentioned before. It seems like a great bike with a good spec. Just get that 2x conversion out of your head. Once you ride that Roker Comp, you will totally forget about the Tamland. Upgrade the wheels when the time is right and we'll all be jealous of your ride. You probably know the first parts to swap after that if you still need to scratch that weight weenie itch.