Best gravel bike for off-road comfort and confident handling? Jamis vs Raleigh vs GT

Hey!

I really need some advice

I am looking for a bike that will allow me to tackle on a single ride both pavement and rough gravel roads and even some sort of singletracks. My primary concern is not road speed but off-road comfort and stability. But at the same time I don't want to buy heavy, slow and not agile bike.

Based on extended research and my budget limitations (I have 2.500 euro for a new bike) I have managed to narrow down the choice to three options. Please tell me, which You would recommend the most.

First is GT Grade Carbon 105. I have managed to test drive it recently and I am very impressed with this bike. Its rear end is very comfortable and the overall riding position is very good (I am 179 cm tall, 82,5 cm inseam and I have tried L - 56 cm version). Bikes feel very agile and a it's a joy to ride but it has a tire clearance for only 35c tire. This should be not a big problem on the rear end (because of its fantastic carbon seatstays) but front fork is not that comfy and without putting bigger tires it may wear me out quite quickly on rough surfaces. The good solution could be shocktop stem suspension but I have to test it to be sure. But overall it is a very tempting bike that gathered a very good experts reviews.

The next proposition is Jamis Renegade. Within my budget I can have either lower quality carbon version called Expert or steel version named Exploit. Superb reviews has the top of the range carbon Elite version but Expert seems also to be very good (apart from very heavy wheels). Steel version is yet to be reviewed but I have read that it's framset is not the highest quality. And of course its heavier than the carbon version but should provide even more comfy ride that Expert (which already is said to be very comfy). The main advantage comparing to Grade is the ability to use 40c tire which should add a lot of comfort (or maybe the difference between 35c and 40c will not be that significant?).

The last bike in this comparison is a new Raleigh Roker. It is a carbon version of Tamland and should be offered in Europe in three version (the lowest trim will be within my price range but for now the cheapest is very well reviewed Roker Pro version). This bike has 1 cm longer chainstays and the longest wheelbase which combined with the biggest BB drop (75 mm) should provide the most stable and confident ride on rough surfaces. Roker also allows 40c tires (and I am thinking about new Schwalbe G-One as the best choice for each of these bikes). The only problem I can see with this bike is very short Head Tube length which may lead to the most race like position which may be a comfort problem for me. Problem even bigger when You take into consideration the fact, that in place where I live there will be no possibility to test ride both Jamis Renegade and Raleigh Roker before buying it.


So in the end I have to relay much on experts and opinions of people who managed to try these bikes and can provide me with their opinions about it. So please tell me, which one of these bike is the best choice for me?

Thanks!

Welcome to the forum! \n\nI doubt anyone is going to recommend a bike and say it's the perfect choice for you. But hopefully we can give you some idea about your selections and maybe offer other things to consider.\n\nI've ridden the two Jamis models you listed. Your impressions are pretty much spot on. The Exploit isn't something I'd recommend in general. It doesn't seem to fit in with the build and ride quality of a serious road/gravel bike. But the Expert is actually very nice. I got my hands on the smallest size, which weighed in around 22.5lbs. It was very smooth. You've probably read reviews on it that said it was 'stable' above all other things. That's how I'd describe it. It's not aggressive or agile, so if you want a snappy bike it probably won't suit you (and was the only reason I didn't buy it). But it had a very nice plush ride on just about any surface. If you went that route and got your bike shop to swap out the wheels for something lighter, you'd have a good bike for all day riding. Just don't expect to win any cyclocross races with it.

So You say that Jamis Renegade Expert offers very smooth ride. But have You ridden GT Grade Carbon? I wonder how big difference makes wider tire of Renegade (35c versus 28c in Grade). Maybe 35c is enough to have a comfortable bike? Or Renegade just is that comfortable bike despite of the wider tires?

I've never seen a GT Grade in person so I can't make a comparison. You might get a little idea of how they might compare by checking the geometry. The jamis has a fairly long wheelbase which is probably why it's so stable. And I'd venture to say that 35c tires will be a factor compared to 28c as far as handling minor changes in terrain and soaking up some buzz. But the geometry (head tube height and angle, in particular) tends to define how a bike handles. And the frame material determines how it feels. It's hard to compare carbon to carbon tho, since the layup can be very different from brand to brand. I'm told the carbon is even different between the Expert and Elite. \n\nFor me personally, I wouldn't consider a bike for gravel grinding unless it had at least 32c tires. The standard is usually 35c. When you get over that you start to see resistance that slows you down on faster surfaces but handles rough terrain better. It all depends on your priorities. \n\nBut others here with more experience might have other thoughts.

35c tire is possible on GT Grade too, so maybe this will be enough. But Jamis as a bike seems to be build with comfort in mind (I have read that it's fork has some extra offset for more comfy ride). And it is true that Expert and Elite are made from different kind of carbon that is why I am so interested in performance of Expert and not Elite (which is the one so well received by the press). Expert is heavier but it looks like it the comfort is still there.

I wonder what Guitar Ted will tell us about Raleigh Roker LTD after some heavy testing. It is an American version but I think the results will be very much comparable to UK variation. 

I have been racing road and mountain bikes on an off for the last 25 years and I just bought my first gravel bike a Jamis Renegade Expert. I have nothing to compare it to other than the fact the price point was far better than other bikes I looked at, and at 30% off retail it was a no brainer. My initial thoughts are were that this bike was set up for a cross between pavement and gravel (gearing and the tires). Since mine is exclusively for gravel and a lot of steep hills, I replaced the 105 crank (50-36) with some carbon FSA (46-36), this creates a much more useful range of gears for my purposes. The geometry is obviously more relaxed than a road bike so it's not going to be as nearly as responsive. However, I would say it climbs like a road bike and descends almost as well even on gravel. I run the stock Clement MSO's tubeless and hammer them on some nasty two track roads with no problems at 40psi. Overall I'd say it's a very fun bike to ride and the relaxed geometry makes short or long rides very forgiving.

Thanks for the answer. Can You tell me how tall You are and what size did You get? This, apart from deciding which bike I should get, is the most important thing for me. Like I said, I can only test GT Grade so either Renegade or Roker I will have to order without any testing. I am 179 cm tall and my inseam measures 82,5 cm. I am thinking that 56 cm will be best. Or should I get smaller frame?

Wife and I are riding 2016 Renegade Experts.  I'm 6'4" and am on a 61cm frame, wife is 5'8" and rides a 54cm frame.

We're riding on WTB Nano 40c Race (tubular version) tires.  Love these bikes and feel that they're very stable.

Hope this helps!

Performance Bikes has a great deal on the GT Grade right now.  And w/the Performance Club you get points worth an additional 10% of cost for future purchases - for a net of c. $1,800.  Also, they frequently they have promos and bump that to 20% which would bring the net to c. $1,600.

http://www.performancebike.com/bikes/Product_10052_10551_1185360_-1___

A friend bought one last Thursday for delivery today.  I looked at it w/him last week and it's impressive.  It does have a Performance only spec w/Force22 hydraulic in case that's an issue though it probably shouldn't be.  In my opinion a hard deal to pass up at that price since most carbon frames cost c. $2,000 and the Force22 group has to be close to $1,000 too.  He's about 5'10" and bought a 55.

I just took delivery of their Ridley X-Trail CR1 using the 20% promo about a week ago - great bike.  I've got 3 rides and about 200 mi so far.  First ride was 30 mi on the road w/the OEM 38c tires.  Then about 65 mi on mixed road/trail on the 38s.  Then I got my road wheels set up and did 82 mi on Saturday.  I had planned to run 25c tires on the road wheels but at the last minute decided on some Vittoria Open Pave in 27c and they were great.

http://www.performancebike.com/bikes/Product_10052_10551_1185378_-1___

Many forks have more clearance for bigger tires than the rear.  So you could consider running a larger tire in the front a la many mountain bikers.  That is, 35c in the back and a 38c or even 40c in the front.  The extra volume will provide a bit more traction and cushion as well as to help minimize pinch flats if running tubes.  This could be very useful for more serious singletrack, sand, rocks and descending.  A buddy of mine with a Diverge is planning to do that as he too is limited to 35c in the rear.  I'm probably going to do the same thing on the X-Trail as a 40c is very tight in the chainstay area.  I will likely run a 38c in back and a 40c in front for rides when it's primarily dirt.

Thanks! These are really great offers but unfortunetaly I am not from USA.  But what is interesting is the fact that You guys in USA have different specs of Grade. Here, in Europe we have Shimano groupset (105 and Ultegra) and in USA GT is using SRAM groupset.

The idea of using different tires is very tempting. I was already thinking about it and maybe if I buy GT Grade Carbon, I will try to fit 40c Schwalbe G-One on the existing fork just to see if it will fit. From what I have read front has a little more clearance than back so it may work. In that case, in the back I would put 35c version. But one thing worries me: is it safe, especially on fast descends to have different size of tires?

I wasn't sure if you can order from Performance or not.  I'd check though to see if they ship international.  And I just got an email that their 20% Points promo starts tomorrow at 9AM - so that's now worth $400.  Over here the GTs from regular dealers, including Performance, are also Shimano - it's just some of the Performance bikes they had especially built for them using the SRAM spec.  It may make sense to have someone buy it over here for you and then ship it.

I like your idea for tires.  The new Schwalbes look great.  Right now I have the WTB Nano 40c TCS mounted.  The front fits fine but it's very tight in the rear - about 2mm on each side at the chain stay.  The bike comes w/Challenge Gravel Grinder in 38c tubed and they fit fine.  So I'll try to find a 38c in tubeless and run that in the back and the Nano in the front.

But, I can't wait for the new Schwalbes to come to market.  The new G-One looks like a great tire.  I plan to use the S-One for mixed road/trail use and the Pro-One on by road bike.  And will recommend that my buddies that are limited to 35c run the G-One though some like bigger knobs on the side of the tires for cornering.

I'm not sure how the different sized tires would handle going fast on gravel but think they would be fine.  On mtn bikes they run a little smaller in back to I think save weight - I run 235 in front and 225 in back.  Especially w/29ers it makes for a faster accelerating wheel and you don't give up much anywhere else.  The main thing is having enough rear traction on climbs.

Norco Search is a great option as well.

bOrderline, I've been riding the Norco Search Ultra for nearly a year now.  I've been really happy with it and have done a lot of both road, fire road, gravel and some single track with it. No idea how it co,pares with the Renegade, a bike I looked at as well.  I've posted some pics in the bikes section. Check them out. 

Thanks for the info. I have some more question regarding Your bike:
 - is this true that the quality of this bike is not the best? (I have read that paint on the frame can have defects and that cables can rattle inside the frame tubes)
- how comfortable is front fork and general riding position (GT Grade has very comfy position for me)
- is there enough clearance for 40mm tire?

bOrderline.

Quality.  For a $ 3,100  all Carbon Fiber bike I think the quality is just fine. No cable rattle that I have noticed. Paint finish is holding up to the beatings I'm giving it.

Geometry, (quite subjective!), is really nice for me.  I'm using a 110 mm stem and I dropped the stack by 5mm.   The longest ride I have done yet is 140 miles.  The Fizik supplied saddle did not work for me so I replaced it with a  Astute saddle. I find the ride very comfortable. I have rode ongravel, rutted fire roads, single track and the bike has handled beautifully.  The long wheel base is really nice in fast gravel/shale descents.

Clearance. I was a little surprised about this.  I thought 38 mm would be max, but 40 mm ought to fit. I'm currently riding on Maxxis Mudwrestler 32's.  

My biggest complaint is that it uses the 386 BB standard, which I don't think is appropriate for a gravel off road bike. The clearance is just not enough.  The chain catcher is not the best and I have dropped the chain twice and both times locked it up.

Looking at my Strava account I have logged just over 2,800 miles on this bike since March this year.

Front clearance.  


Rear clearance.
 

Bottom bracket, Chain catcher.

Hitchhiker, thank You very much for this very detailed answer. To be honest I was thinking that You have a carbon version but it looks like You have an aluminium frame. I am glad to hear that despite alu frame Your bike is very comfortable. The last question that I have is about DiamondBack Haanjo Comp. Have You considered it when choosing the bike for You. I initially have not consideret alu bikes but right now I am very open to this idea and I think Norco Search and this DiamondBack Haanjo Comp are two most interesting choices. Thet have geometry very similar to GT Grade Carbon, yet they both allow 40c tires which is huge advantage in terms of comfort. 

It looks carbon to me... No weld, and that huge bb area is not alu

OK, my mistake. I was looking at the pictures of Narco Search on theirs website and saw ALU version in a very similar colors that Hitchhiker's bike has. So in the end: comfort = carbon...