As best as I could try different titanium models, I found differences in flex. My Moots Routt 45 has the comfy titanium feel but the rear and bottom bracket area seem stiffer than most titanium and composite bikes I tried. For example hearing some chain rub at the extremes of a 2x crank. On Zwift or similar, I'm the last person to ask but I have had 1x and 2x gravel bikes and like my 2x for the close range and less extreme chainline in some circumstances.
There are lots of great choices out there. I believe a Moots would be more expensive than mine was a year ago but I can absolutely say I have no regrets. They have more tube diameters than some bikes I tried and checked out. They do stuff like sleeves and have butting with even more expensive models. Having once been in metal working and fabrication, they have fantastic double pass welds. I think minimal risk when I've seen some small ti builders. It seems like some titanium alloy bikes use an OEM tube set without the many diameters a Moots has.
I used to have a 2019 Warbird, I can’t say it felt very flexy at any cadence. Have you ridden other gravel bikes? They are going to feel more flexy than a road bike just from the bigger tires with lower pressures. Those silly paired spoke wheels aren’t helping your cause either.
Do you have Praxis Carbon crankset on both? I have an Open UP that I built up with the same crank, and I noticed that when I really torque it (stand on the pedals, or sprint) it flexes some, even getting some rubbing on the front derailleur. You can see the flex looking down on it. It doesn't bother me as much, as I'm pretty light and it saves quite a bit of weight over regular GRX crank, but could be more problematic with more powerful riders.
My locally built wheels are silly? We have Hunts on the other Warbird, with “non-silly” spokes. It’s not the wheels. I think it’s the seat post / seat stays that are flexing. No issues with the cranks climbing and that’s when I would feel them. We have 20% grades.
only other gravel bike I’ve ridden is an aluminum grail. No issues on it. Seems like the Warbird is designed this way? Comfortable in Kansas?
Salsa designed the Warbird and the Cutthroat with Class 5 VRS (Vibration Reduction System). Yes.. the seatstays and chainstays flex to absorb some of that high frequency vibration common to gravel. I had concerns about what you describe when I bought the Warbird frameset, but have found it to be a blessing in disguise.
The bouncy feeling and flexing from pedaling is because your pedal stroke is not fluid and round. Try it. Pedal so the bouncing stops and then relearn how to ride your bike. Stiff frames will hide deficiencies in your pedal stroke. Trust me, you will make more power, more effieciently and not get as beat up by the road and will come to appreciate it over time.
I have never ridden a Warbird and never (knowingly) pedaled at 105 rpm but I have built enough bikes to know changing the frameset is both expensive and time consuming. I would first try these simple tests: Pump up (way up) and/or swap the tires. Big tires at low pressures on relatively narrow rims can bounce and steer badly on pavement. Swap the seatpost. Your post looks pretty long so if it's extralight in might be too flexible.
I also think mtbnut87 has a good suggestion. I used to do a lot of rowing in different kinds of boats. In a wide, heavy whaleboat you can do anything you want as long as you pull hard. In a narrow, light eight-oared shell technique is a lot more important but a rower could thrash around a little bit and not disturb the boat too much. In a narrower, lighter single that style would throw the boat all over the place. Smoothness really pays off. One of my biggest coaching challenges was getting an experienced whaleboat crew to row in an eight. I ended up having them row two at a time with the other six oars off the water so they could feel the effects of their movements. And we got everything else worked out before picking up the cadence.
I used to feel that on my Revolt with its D-Fuse seatpost. I put a different D-Fuse on and now I have AB oval rings. I don't notice it anymore. It was always more noticeable on the road than gravel when you're kind of bouncing anyway.
My average cadence is 90ish and that's with coasting a bunch because I'm 200 lbs.
Of course, my power could be smoother - and to take the opportunity to perfect out my circles is an excellent approach. I think the carbon seat post is a problem too - and my racer friend took my seat off today and he was able to take that brooks and bend it like a pretzel.
I have a long Thomson and a Specialized Power saddle I'll try out tomorrow and see how that affects it.
Now for riding more gravel, I think you are absolutely correct. The Warbird is awesome on gravel, and cadence just isn't an issue on the back roads. The sticks and holes are! In fact, most of the time the 1x is perfect when riding the back roads.
Different bikes do different things. I will repeat that 10x while doing my intervals today. 😀
I just wanted to close off this thread with a realization why Salsa spec'd the carbon Warbird with an aluminum seatpost. It made all the difference in the world!
I swapped out the carbon Easton and carbon Brooks for a Thomson and a power saddle. Both aluminum.
Thank you @mtbnut87 for the kind suggestion that my pedal stroke could be better. And @ljsmith - if you think my wheels were making my seatpost flex, holy smokes. But I will always get a great laugh out of my silly locally built wheels from now on.
I will still swap out the 1x when an extra grand comes my way - but without the flex, it matters much less!
It's not where Rolfs are built that makes them silly, it's where the spoke holes are. Not evenly distributing spokes leads to a wheel that isn't as strong universally around all parts.
That said Campy and a few others have similar gimmicks and I've never read any complaints on funky patterns causing problems.
I don't need your brosplaining buddy. And I don't have the time or need to explain to you that you don't know your ass from a hole in the ground. What my wheels had to do with a seatpost question affirms that you should be out, far far away on your gravel bike. Shed some of that weight man. Get faster. Pick on other peoples wheels.
